# Tricky Situation - Visa options for Russian Citizen



## Traveller01 (Nov 4, 2012)

I will start by describing my somewhat complex situation with my girlfriend from Russia.

We met 3 years ago and have been in regular contact with eachother, when we decided to enter into a long-distance relationship about 1.5yrs ago.

During this time we have holidayed in Thailand, she came to Australia to visit me for 2 months, I visited Russia for 3 months and then we subsequently traveled in Europe together for short stints.

It is my intention to bring her out to Australia for 12mths to realistically see if she can see herself prospectively living in Australia permanently in the future with me, however I'm really stuck on what visa options are available to her!?

A de-facto visa is not an option for us as we have spent no longer than 5mths together in a 12mth period. We would consider study options (cost?) however it would be preferable to get some kind of visa which enables her to work during her stay.

If i could hear from anyone who has been in a similar situation or anyone that may be able to point me in the right direction i would be most appreciative. 

Currently it all seems very daunting and due to Russia being a high-risk country, it makes the task very difficult.


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## tiffiny (Oct 20, 2012)

Either a student visa or a prospective marriage visa. For the prospective marriage visa, After the visa is granted, she'll have one year to enter the country (it helps to do it before the medicals and police checks expire). The cost is a little over $2,000. So once she enters, you two will have nine months to get married. So you can decide if she is really the one you want to marry in the 9 months. If you're not sure about marrying her then get a student visa and after living together for 12 months and sharing bills. You two can get a partner visa. 

So does she really want to study and get a part time job and live with you or get a full time job with the prospective marriage visa and marry you? 

Hope this helps! I'm working on my prospective marriage visa and previously had a student visa in New Zealand.


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## Boboa (Mar 24, 2009)

Tourist visa will be the cheapest option but she can't work on this visa


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## Traveller01 (Nov 4, 2012)

Thanks for your response Tiffiny.

At this stage I'm open to considering ALL options as we're merely going to try to get her out here for approx. 12mths to see if it is likely to work longer term.

The complexities of our situation stem further from what i wrote - She's an identical twin and so am I, and we're both extremely close to our twins and families. So ultimately, if she can't be away from her family, friends and twin sister then it won't work out. So to get her here on a '12 month' trial i think is crucial, 

As for the prospective marriage visa, i feel that this might be a bit premature and put unnecessary pressure at this point to make a 'quick' decision within 9mths to marry. 

I think possibly the student visa might be the best option for now to enable us to get a partner visa in the future, and i think the balance between doing this and part-time work while living with me in the meantime would probably be best.

Would you happen to know any institutions in Melbourne where getting a 'cheap' student visa for studying say French, Spanish or even Public Relations might be possible? 

At this point i'm clutching at straws just to get her out here on a 'trial' basis before we jump into anything. And a tourist visa would not be suitable as she's done this once before for a couple of months, however over a longer period this just wouldn't be viable.

Thanks for your help!


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## tiffiny (Oct 20, 2012)

International student fees are crazy expensive. It's usually close to double what an Australian would pay. 


My opinion, be selfless and move to Russia for a year. Would you choose family or her? And after the year, you two can move to Australia if that is what both of you want.


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## Boboa (Mar 24, 2009)

tiffiny said:


> International student fees are crazy expensive. It's usually close to double what an Australian would pay.
> 
> My opinion, be selfless and move to Russia for a year. Would you choose family or her? And after the year, you two can move to Australia if that is what both of you want.


International student and local student fees are the same. The only difference is that Australian government pays half or so of fees on behalf of Australians.


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## Traveller01 (Nov 4, 2012)

Thanks guys.

What are the requirements on companies being able to sponsor her?

I am wanting to call companies to see what my luck might be for having them sponsor her for say 12mths...At this stage i'm not really in a position where i want to relocate to Moscow for 12mths


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## Aussie_Girl7 (Aug 28, 2011)

personally ive heard of many risk stories about women coming from Russia, and im not about to stereotype them, but just be very careful as i have heard that some take advantage of australian men, and ditch them after they get their citizenship...but i wish you well. on a positive note, if she doesnt need to work you can get a 3 month tourist visa and have it extended a few times ( some countries dont allow extensions) but its worth a thought. i think she would need $1000 per month to support herself to get an extension. good luck..i wish u well..


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## Ausstart National (Aug 22, 2012)

I really think, the tourist visa is your best, and only realistic option at this point.

You could consider the VET 572 visa, but she would have to provide evidence that she had access to funds to meet the study costs and living costs. Being a high risk country, the living costs would exceed $25, 000 dollars alone.

The best option would be to have the tourist visa, and see how things progress. 
In a couple of months time, you could later consider the PMV subclass 300 partner visa.

UNless she is a skilled worker, and have the qualifications or skills to perform a skilled job, getting sponsorship from a business for the would be close to impossible.

Sorry to say, but there are only a few options.


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## Traveller01 (Nov 4, 2012)

Thanks for your response Chris, although quite bleak options...

If she were to come out to Australia on a tourist visa for approx. 3mths and we were to go down the path of PMV, at what point would we need to start gathering all of the paperwork and submit by to make sure we have it all sorted in order to extend her stay and meet the the 9mth marriage deadline?


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## Ausstart National (Aug 22, 2012)

Traveller01 said:


> Thanks for your response Chris, although quite bleak options...
> 
> If she were to come out to Australia on a tourist visa for approx. 3mths and we were to go down the path of PMV, at what point would we need to start gathering all of the paperwork and submit by to make sure we have it all sorted in order to extend her stay and meet the the 9mth marriage deadline?


Hi Mate

Extending a tourist visa is not a real easy thing to do, unless there is a real need for it to be extended. Because it is a tourist visa, the main idea is that the tourist leave Australia.

if 3 months was the length of the visa, then that would likely be all they would give.

Your partner needs to be outside Australia to apply for the prospective marriage visa. She can't apply for it in Australia.

Before a PMV 300 can be granted, you need to provide evidence that you plan to really get married, and live together as husband and wife. You should include with the PMV application a (Notice of Intention to Marry - marriages taking place in Australia only) and confirmation that you have scheduled, or are discussing the date and time of marriage with a registered marriage celebrant. You can find a copy of the most recent NOIM here.

Always the PMV 300 is only valid for 9 months, and can not be extended.
Also, the date of the wedding generally must be within 6 months of the marriage celebrants letter. If you lodge a NOIM as well, this can be longer, toward the 7 and 8 month period.

You can not extend the PMV 300.

Actually, you do not have to be married in Australia. You are free to marry in any country, but the marriage must be recognised under Australian law. So, after making the PMV 300 application, she is free to come to Australia, and then maybe you could both return to russia and be married, or another country and be married.

Still, you idea of testing the waters first it a good idea. Tourist for 3 months, and then see what happens.


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## Traveller01 (Nov 4, 2012)

Also, i'm wondering what is best in terms of marriage:

To get her out to Australia and marry
OR
To travel to Russia and marry and then return to Australia as a married couple?

What is the easiest option if planning to both live in Australia?


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## MarkNortham (Dec 19, 2012)

Hi Traveller -

Depends on when you want to live in Australia together. If soon after marriage, easier to get married here on a PMV visa, then lodge onshore partner visa and she can get a Bridging Visa A which allows her to stay in Australia while the partner visa application is being processed (can be up to 12-18 months in some cases). 

If you marry in Russia and then travel here to lodge the onshore partner visa, the issue will be getting her here on a visa - Russian citizens often have condition 8503 (No Further Stay) attached to visitor visas, which would prevent you from lodging the onshore partner visa unless you were able to get a waiver of this condition.

Hope this helps -

Best,

Mark Northam


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## Traveller01 (Nov 4, 2012)

Thanks Mark - great advice and very much appreciated.

With the PMV, does this visa still allow travel back and forth from Australia to Russia?

Same for the Partner VIsa?

I'm just trying to weigh up all options so i know the best choice to make...


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## MarkNortham (Dec 19, 2012)

Hi Traveller -

Yes to both questions - the PMV allows multiple entries over its 9 month duration, as does the provisional partner visa (1st 2 years typically, unless the permanent partner visa is issued straight away). The Bridging Visa A that's issued until the partner visa decision is made ceases if you leave Australia, however you can apply for a Bridging Visa B for each trip out (trips should be for a "substantial reason"), then re-enter Australia on the BV-B and re-apply for the BV-A which you'll get automatically, then wait on that until a decision.


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## Traveller01 (Nov 4, 2012)

Thanks Mark.

So just to clarify the steps which we may take would be:

Get her out here on a PMV (what is the criteria and costs associated with this?)

Then a Provisional Partner Visa A is issued for up to 2 years (again criteria and costs?)

And eventually this leads to a Partner Visa


Does leaving the country to travel while on a PM-A mean that you lose that initial waiting period for your partner visa or does it still become valid once a PM-B is issued and then apply for the PM-A visa again?


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## Traveller01 (Nov 4, 2012)

Also, does the PMV allow her to work whilst in Australia for the 9mths?


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## MarkNortham (Dec 19, 2012)

Hi Traveller -

Happy to clarify. If you bring her here on the subclass 300 Prospective Marriage Visa, she has 9 months once she enters Australia to marry. She can work during these 9 months (no limit) and can come and go to/from Australia as she pleases during this period.

After marrying, but before the PMV expires, you could apply for the subclass 820/801 onshore partner visa. You'd be given a Bridging Visa A (BV-A), which activates as soon as her PMV expires. The bridging visa A is good until the decision on your 820/801 partner visa application. If she needs to take a trip out of Australia while on a BV-A, she needs to get a BV-B for the trip, then she returns and reactivates the BV-A.

One you're approved for the partner visa, you'll either get the subclass 820 provisional partner visa for 2 years, then be able to apply for the subclass 801 permanent partner visa, or you might get the 801 right away, up to DIAC. But either way, she can work, come and go as she likes while she's on the 820 or 801. The 2-year waiting period for the 801 (if you don't get it straight away) won't be affected by whether she makes trips outside Australia, etc during that time.

As to fees, DIAC fees are:

PMV - 2,680
Partner (onshore) - 3,975

If you choose to use a migration agent, you can ask them about their fees - we publish our fees at:

Our Fees - Northam & Associates

Hope this helps - please advise any further info I can provide -

Best,

Mark Northam


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## Traveller01 (Nov 4, 2012)

Brilliant- that's fantastic information!

A few more questions off the top of my head and not sure if you'd know the answer to the first one, but if we have to be married within the 9mths, at what stage would we need to be in talks with a marriage celebrant etc. to organise the wedding?

Also, if i am planning on getting her out here in about June, how soon would we need to get our paperwork together and apply for this visa?

The fee for the partner visa of almost $4,000, is this the costs we'll incur should we get married and move onto this visa?

Your services of almost $2,000 - what does this include?

Sorry for all of the questions but just need to be 100% clear on everything before we proceed.


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## MarkNortham (Dec 19, 2012)

Hi Traveller -

To respond to your queries -

You'll need documents from the intended parriage celebrant to lodge with your subclass 300 PMV application. Specifically, a Notice of Intent to Marry and a letter from the celebrant confirming they intend to marry you.

Re: DIAC fees - If you do PMV and Partner Visa, the DIAC application fee for the PMV is $2,680 and the additional fee to apply for the onshore partner visa if you do so while holding the PMV is $995. If you end up marrying during the 9 months but applying for the partner visa later after the PMV expires, but while still in Australia (perhaps on another visa - student, etc), then the additional fee for the partner visa is $1,260.

Re: Our fees - I want to be sensitive to not appearing like I'm on here pitching my services and promoting - with that in mind as you asked, our fee for the PMV or Partner Visa (or package) is a complete turnkey package - we provide migration assistance and regulation checks to identify the best migration pathway for you, gather info from you in a single PDF fillable form, complete all DIAC forms, provide checklists, assist you with gathering relationship evidence, write a detailed submission letter describing your relationship, assist with statements, certify doc copies, etc. For more details, please email me at [email protected] or PM me here.

Hope this helps!

Best,

Mark Northam


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## Traveller01 (Nov 4, 2012)

Thanks Mark.

If if i am planning on getting her out here in about June, how soon would we need to get our paperwork together and apply for this visa?

How complex is the documentation needed in order to apply for this visa and could you please refer me to a checklist of documents and evidence we'll need to start gathering?

I guess lastly, is this the visa you would most recommend for me to get in order for my girlfriend to come out here and legally be able to work? (i have not seen any other options to me at this stage, and it will be a good way of testing the waters before marriage)


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## MarkNortham (Dec 19, 2012)

Hi -

The processing time for the PMV visa can be 6-9 months, so you would need to apply right away.

Re: our custom checklists and evidence guides, if you choose to engage us to prepare your visa application, I can provide those once we have completed the Client Service Agreement. You can also get some information on this on the immi.gov.au site - if you google "300 visa DIAC" you'll find the page, and there is more info there.

Without more details I can't give you any specific recommendation. But if she needs to be able to work, that rules out the visitor visas, and as she's not from a Working Holiday Visa eligible country, that rules out that option. If you're engaged and want her to come here to be with you for a while prior to getting married, the 9 month period on the FIance visa may be the best option, short of a full-on work visa such as a 457 temporary work visa which would require a sponsoring employer.

Hope this helps - if I can provide any further info, please PM me here or email [email protected]


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## Traveller01 (Nov 4, 2012)

Thanks Mark.

I was worried that the processing time would be quite lengthy for this so it seems that I'm already falling behind to have her out here by June.

I realistically wouldn't be able to afford your services at this point as much as that would help so i will have to do a lot of reading and background work to ensure that I cover off everything that is required.

Thanks very much once again - i'm sure I will formulate a lot more questions throughout the process but off the top of my head I can't think of anything I haven't asked already.


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## MarkNortham (Dec 19, 2012)

Hi -

I understand - a few key things to consider as you do your own application:
* Go over the subclass 300 checklist and partner evidence details on the immi.gov.au website in detail
* Since the 300 must be lodged in the applicant's home country, find the website for the Australian Embassy, etc in that country and see if they have their "own" subclass 300 checklist and additional procedures - sometimes countries add on their own requirements
* If your relationship evidence is thin, include more statements from friends, family, professional acquaintances that can help establish your relationship as genuine, etc
* Check out the exact lodging procedures in the country you'll be lodging the application in and follow them. If in doubt, contact them for clarification.
* Form 80 may or may not be required depending on the Embassy, etc. It's now being commonly asked for (after lodging) for people from many countries. You may want to consider completing and lodging this form with your application to try and speed things along, rather than waiting for them to ask for it.

Hope this helps - good luck with your case!

Best,

Mark Northam


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## Traveller01 (Nov 4, 2012)

Very helpful advice - thank you

So to be clear on this, although all of the details are filled out for an 'Australian' Prospective Marriage Visa, this must be lodged by my partner in Russia?


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## MarkNortham (Dec 19, 2012)

Yes, exactly. The Australian embassy in Moscow is where you would lodge that if your fiance is a Russian citizen - the application would be processed by their staff. In that regard, make sure you check whether that embassy has any additional requirements for the visa application over and above what is specified on the official DIAC checklist, and double check the application lodging procedures as well - these can vary from Embassy to Embassy.

Best,

Mark Northam



Traveller01 said:


> Very helpful advice - thank you
> 
> So to be clear on this, although all of the details are filled out for an 'Australian' Prospective Marriage Visa, this must be lodged by my partner in Russia?


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## Traveller01 (Nov 4, 2012)

So that being the case, then most of the forms will need to be downloaded and filled out in Russian rather than English?


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## MarkNortham (Dec 19, 2012)

Nope, all must be in English, the official processing language of DIAC. Any docs (birth cert, etc) in Russian must be translated to English by at NAATI qualified translator or equivalent.


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## Traveller01 (Nov 4, 2012)

My fiance is a qualified translator with exceptional English/Russian translating capabilities so I'd hope that she could translate all of the documents without having to incur further costs.

In your experience, what is the success/failure rates of this type of visa?

Also, does it normally take approx 6mths from date of lodgement or the entire process of collecting documents/evidence, translations etc...
Is there any way to speed up this process at all?

I'm hopeful to get my fiance out to Australia in about June if possible.


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## MarkNortham (Dec 19, 2012)

Hi Travellor01 -

That's good news re: translations!

Re: timeframe, generally 6 months from date of lodgement; you need to submit all docs, forms and info at lodgement except for the medical check, which the Embassy will usually ask for when processing is underway for your application.

Re: success rates, impossible to say without seeing your application forms, evidence and statements. Red flags that can cause a closer examination can include country of origin (Russian citizens in partner and fiance visa applications can warrant a higher degree of scrutiny due to fraud from that country), length of relationship, age difference between the applicant and sponsor. Key to getting these through is the relationship evidence and statements. If evidence is thin or risk factors are present, then statements and/or evidence should be strengthened, etc. 

Hope this helps - please advise if I can be of any further assistance. In addition to doing full representation of clients, we also do application reviews where we can review your application package prior to lodgement and provide comments/feedback/suggestions.

Best,

Mark Northam


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## Traveller01 (Nov 4, 2012)

Hi Mark,

With relation to the Health Checks, i've read on a forum that someone else had to have the medicals done abroad and then have the results sent to Sydney for assessment. 

Apparently this is 'normal procedure'. 

Can you please clarify?

And from what i've read, my fiance in Russia will be required to have:
- medical examination
- a chest x-ray 
- a HIV test

Is this all correct?

I'd like to get some clarity on this please.


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## MarkNortham (Dec 19, 2012)

Hi -

That's correct. For the PMV I believe in some jurisdictions you can elect to only have the chest x-ray, but many people who are planning on lodging a partner visa application choose to have all 3 test done once - generally they will not have to be done again for the partner visa if you have all 3 done for the PMV.

Generally the panel doctors are set up to electronically send the results to DIAC.

Hope this helps!

Best,

Mark Northam


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## Traveller01 (Nov 4, 2012)

Well that's good news with sending the results electronically as hopefully there's no unnecessary waiting times. 

Will my fiancé be needing to go to a specific doctor to have these done?

(What is the chest x-ray all about? I understand the other two for obvious reasons..)


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## MarkNortham (Dec 19, 2012)

Chest x-ray is for tuberculosis, the one disease that is mentioned in migration law by name.

Yes, must be a "Panel Doctor" - here's the link, just click on the country you're interested in. Note eHealth logos on electronically-connected sites (better).

Contact Us

Best,

Mark Northam


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## Traveller01 (Nov 4, 2012)

Thanks again Mark.

With relation to sending photo's as proof, generally 'How Many' is considered acceptable?
(We have traveled to many places over the past 3 years, about 6 trips in total, so would 10 photo's from each destination be sufficient?


With Statutory Declarations, are these something that myself (as the sponsor) will need to provide or will my fiance in Russia need to provide some too to prove our Relationship from her friends and family too?

Also, given the fact that i'm not currently working (should be within about a month or so), will this pose as a serious question-mark over the application despite the fact that i can financially support her?
(I'm not working currently due to quitting my job to go overseas for several months to visit my fiance.)

Thanks again!


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## MarkNortham (Dec 19, 2012)

Hi -

Re: photos, anywhere between 10 and 40 is typical of what we submit depending on the quality and context of the photos.

Re: stat decs/statements - you need to provide one from you (sponsor), one from applicant, and as many from other people as you feel is necessary to properly evidence and support your relationship. Only the stmts from you and your fiance are required, but we always recommend additional statements from family/friends to support the relationship, especially if the relationship evidence otherwise is thin or relationship time is short. All must be certified copies, translated into English.

Also re: translations, I missed a comment you made earlier re: your fiance being a translator - while I realise this would save you a lot of money, I would consider if it might raise concerns about the impartiality of the translator in the eyes of DIAC. It's a personal decision you have to make, but it's the same reasoning why people like JP's (Justices of the Peace) cannot witness a document for themselves. It is less of a matter with translations, since translations do not involve confirming identity and making a subjective call re: the veracity of the person. I think the chance of this causing a problem is remote, and there's nothing in the migration regulations I see that prevents this, but wanted to bring it up in any case. Also, might check local regulations in her country if she's licensed re: whether it's OK to do as well. The last thing you need is some silly local regulation (or over-zealous case officer) causing in issue.

Re: not working, I don't see a big issue however I don't have all of your info so I can't give you anything specific. I would suggest including a note in the extension page of the 40SP form or in the cover letter, wherever it makes sense, to let them know you've taken time off from working and why, and detail your plans to return to work.

Best,

Mark Northam


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## Traveller01 (Nov 4, 2012)

All great tips - Thank you!

With regard to the photo's we supply, is there supposed to be a clear direction they take or are they just supposed to show the different stages of our relationship?

Any key points you could comment on in relation to the photo's we need to supply?

(I'm making sure there's plenty of photo's of the two of us, as well as some with my fiance with my family and friends...and these will support Stat. Decs)


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## Traveller01 (Nov 4, 2012)

My fiancé and I have been together over 3.5yrs and while gathering evidence for our PMV 300 visa, we've uncovered about 500pgs of Facebook emails, about te same amount of phone messages using WhatsApp and many many more through regular email and Facebook 'Wall' comments to eachother.

What is considered as sufficient to include and what is too much?

What exactly are the immigration/migration agents in Moscow actually looking for?


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## mcru (Jan 25, 2013)

Sorry double post


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## mcru (Jan 25, 2013)

! 
They're looking for this:

http://www.russia.embassy.gov.au/files/mscw/Partner Visa Document Checklist.pdf

Go through all the forms, guidance and the partner visa booklet from the immigration website, it should be fairly clear.

For emails/whatsapp/photos etc just have a select few key ones at the beginning to demonstrate length of time and maybe along key moments, and I included a log of messages. I personally think the stat decs and the history in your stat dec are more important, but who knows. We included about 15 key photos over time and demonstrating a geographic location (e.g. in front of red square together). Could have given heaps more but in reality the case officers are pretty switched on, if its genuine it should be easy for them to read between the lines. It's just to verify what you have written. Even so all our paperwork was about 1.5 inches thick!

Oh - tell you missus to get her Russian police Clearance ASAP - it takes at least a month to get. 
Also - we had a wedding date booked in Australia last September. Lucky we didn't organise that one too much ... Don't plan on getting her here before September. That's if everything is fine and you get it all in very soon and you are lucky. Probably longer, as you get to sit in the queue with everyone else. Just being realistic.


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## Traveller01 (Nov 4, 2012)

Cheers for that

With your log of messages, did you just list the date and times they were sent?

I've already got her applying for a police check and i think that's already underway. That's definitely one of the things that takes longer to get organised.

We have a wedding date booked for November so i'm hoping we can send off the application by the end of Feb.

Did you get yours approved and how long did it take, or still waiting?


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