# Refusal on going from 820 to 801 immediately due to length of de facto relationship



## SharKs (Feb 12, 2017)

Hi,

*Summary:
I was living with my partner for over 3 years when we applied for the 820/801 visa (with plenty of evidence supporting this), however when we were granted the visa we only got the 820. I can't get a clear answer as to why we didn't get the 801. Is there anything I can do to get the 801? Or get an explanation on why we didn't meet the criteria? Or is anyone in the same situation? 
*

Long version:
So I met my Australian partner in March 2011 and moved in with him (in Australia) on the 6th of January 2013... I worked here in Australia on a work visa hoping to obtain PR through my work. However in 2015 we heard that due to some circumstances this was not possible and therefore we decided to apply for a partner visa instead. We read the information about it and the partner migration booklet said you could bypass the two year waiting period and go straight to 801 (PR) if you had been living together for 3 years or more. So we decided to wait with applying for a partner visa until mid January 2016, thinking that this would prevent us from having to go through the whole system twice. We could wait because my work visa would be valid until mid 2017.

In April 2017 our application got approved, and we got granted the 820. Dissapointed that we did not get the 801, I sent an email to my visa processing centre that we thought we would be eligible for 801 due to the length of our de facto relationship, and pointing out which evidence in our application supported this (joint bank account opened the day after I moved here, letters to my partner and to me to the same address dating back > 3 years, evidence that my partner helped me move from Europe to Australia, stat decs from friends and family supporting this, etc etc). However, the temporary partner visa processing centre never replied to my email (this was 5 weeks ago), even though I sent two reminders.

So yesterday I decided to email the permanent processing centre instead, explaining my situation, and they informed me:

_"Your application met subclass 820 visa requirements at the time of decision and did not meet subclass 801 visa requirements.

The decision on your Temporary Partner (Subclass 820) visa has already been made and cannot be revisited." _

Also that: _the case Officer who assessed and approved the UK820 visa was not satisfied that the information met the legislative requirements for the grant of the BS801 permanent residence visa._

Is there anything I can do about this? 
We thought our evidence was solid and we did not get any explanation on why this was not satisfactory.... We really don't want to go through all this again and find the way we were treated very unfair. Is anyone else in the same situation?


Timeline:
I met my partner: 1/3/2011
Decided to be in a committed relationship: 20/01/2012
Moved in with my partner (started de facto): 06/01/2013
Partner visa application: 16/01/2016
820 grant: 19/04/2017

Thank you!


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## MarcellusF (Nov 6, 2015)

Ah man. That sucks. They could have asked you for more evidence of the length of your relationship before denying the 801. I really am starting lose my respect for Australian bureaucracy. Just rubber stamps and red pens...


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## Mish (Jan 13, 2013)

MarcellusF said:


> Ah man. That sucks. They could have asked you for more evidence of the length of your relationship before denying the 801. I really am starting lose my respect for Australian bureaucracy. Just rubber stamps and red pens...


I said exactly the same earlier today in a different thread. There was someone (I can't remember their name) and they applied offshore at the USA embassy and the case officer emailed them asking for more evidence incase they could grant them the 100 but they just didn't have enough so the case officer could not. However, atleast the case officer tried and asked.


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## Mish (Jan 13, 2013)

SharKs

I was thinking about this since you posted earlier today. I am wondering if because you didn't have any joint bills and more joint evidence that is why they didn't grant the 801?

Did you upload a letter asking to be considered for 801 at all?

My only thought apart from seeing if you can appeal (post in Ask Mark if you haven't and see if you can) is lodging a complaint with immigration and asking them for clarification about why you were not granted the 801.

I know that it says in the partner booklet that case officers do not need to request further evidence however majority of the case officers do.


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## SharKs (Feb 12, 2017)

Mish said:


> I said exactly the same earlier today in a different thread. There was someone (I can't remember their name) and they applied offshore at the USA embassy and the case officer emailed them asking for more evidence incase they could grant them the 100 but they just didn't have enough so the case officer could not. However, atleast the case officer tried and asked.


Thank you. I might contact an agent and see if they can get someone to look at it (again), or tell us which evidence they are missing.


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## SharKs (Feb 12, 2017)

Mish said:


> SharKs
> 
> I was thinking about this since you posted earlier today. I am wondering if because you didn't have any joint bills and more joint evidence that is why they didn't grant the 801?
> 
> ...


Thank you! This is helpful  I did send an email asking about 801 (before we had a CO though), and I uploaded a document in my Immiaccount which asked about 801.


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## Mish (Jan 13, 2013)

SharKs said:


> Thank you. I might contact an agent and see if they can get someone to look at it (again), or tell us which evidence they are missing.


Unfortunately, if you are missing evidence to be granted an 801 upfront I don't think they will revisit the decision and ask for new documents. You can always try though.


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## SharKs (Feb 12, 2017)

Mish said:


> Unfortunately, if you are missing evidence to be granted an 801 upfront I don't think they will revisit the decision and ask for new documents. You can always try though.


do you know which evidence they would need? There is evidence of our joint bank account (the opening of it and the statements) which was used daily for >3 years before our application (by us both), and our address is registered there too. Letters to my partner on our address, letters to me on our address, stat decs of friends and family stating we lived together for that long (9 in total), records of my partner helping me move country.... that's what I can think of at the moment. If that's not enough I wonder what the criteria are for being granted a 801? Do you know?


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## michaels249 (May 24, 2017)

Just a thought ...

from what I understand from your story, is that your case is borderline. That is, you moved in with your partner on the 6th of January 2013 and you applied for a partner visa in mid January 2016. Indeed, you have been in a de facto relationship for 3 years but just on the border of 3 years. The booklet of the partner visa states that you are eligible to go straight to the 801 visa if you have been in a 3+ year de facto relationship when you applied for the 820/801 (i.e., 06/01/2013). I would have waited another 6 months to make your case stronger for the 2nd stage of the partner visa.

Being in a de facto relationship means more than just moving in together and joining bank accounts. It is the date that you fully committed to a shared life together to the exclusion of all others. For example, my partner and I put each other's names in our wills, nominated each as beneficiary in a binding death superannuation, and officially registered our de facto relationship (maybe you did the same thing, I don't know, it is not clear from your story). Your case officer might have given this extra attention since your de facto relationship is almost exactly 3 years.

Again, I am not aware of your personal circumstances ... just a thought. And ... veel succes met de 801 visa, wij zijn pas in het beginstadium van het veel te lange proces.




Application date: 12/05/2017
Medical check: 15/05/2017
Police checks: 01/04/2017


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## SharKs (Feb 12, 2017)

michaels249 said:


> Just a thought ...
> 
> from what I understand from your story, is that your case is borderline. That is, you moved in with your partner on the 6th of January 2013 and you applied for a partner visa in mid January 2016. Indeed, you have been in a de facto relationship for 3 years but just on the border of 3 years. The booklet of the partner visa states that you are eligible to go straight to the 801 visa if you have been in a 3+ year de facto relationship when you applied for the 820/801 (i.e., 06/01/2013). I would have waited another 6 months to make your case stronger for the 2nd stage of the partner visa.
> 
> ...


Thank you for your thoughts. We did all of this too, however some things we did not do in the first week of moving in together. In South Australia it is not possible to register your de facto relationship unfortunately. It just feels so silly that we waited with applying because it said that 3 years counts as 'long term relationship' and then we did not end up getting it anyway. We could have applied so much earlier! It also feels a bit silly because by the time it was assessed we were another 15 months further and we uploaded evidence every step of the way (so when they looked at it we had evidence of >4 years of living together and 6 years of travelling together, dating etc)
That said, we were committed to each other before we 'officially' moved in with each other... in the weeks before this we were in the Netherlands together for instance he helped me move out of my apartment.... I lived with him for a bit in 2012 during the months I was in Australia and he with me when he was in the Netherlands in 2012. But I guess we'll have to wait and see...

Jij ook succes met de aanvraag! Ik hoop dat het niet te lang duurt.


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## Skybluebrewer (Jan 15, 2016)

Did you provide more solid proof that you lived together? A lease, actual bills to that address in both of your names, etc.

I don't think you and other people claiming you lived together and some letters addressed to both of you at that address mean much in the way of hard evidence.


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## SharKs (Feb 12, 2017)

Skybluebrewer said:


> Did you provide more solid proof that you lived together? A lease, actual bills to that address in both of your names, etc.
> 
> I don't think you and other people claiming you lived together and some letters addressed to both of you at that address mean much in the way of hard evidence.


No, the house is owned by my partner's parents so we do not have a lease agreement or utility bills in our names. However, we do have bills from things like health insurance, phone bills and letters from ATO and government bodies addressed to my partner, and letters addressed to me, to the same address (not only addressed to both of us I mean)


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## Skybluebrewer (Jan 15, 2016)

Maybe that has something to do with it. Anyone can give an address to receive mail without having to live there. I think something like a utility bill, water bill, or lease would have had more weight. 

I guess only your CO(s) know the reason why. Shame they don't give you more information.


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## SharKs (Feb 12, 2017)

Thank you all for offering suggestions and help. Today I called immigration who told me they couldn't really help me (kind of the same response as the email), and I sent a response to the email I received asking if they could explain why it was refused. Later that day the CO called me and said she would look into it, and explained they were really busy and she had to look at my application in some more detail. A couple of hours later I had a voice mail saying they looked at my bank statements, and a couple of minutes later I received my grant! So thank you for all the suggestions, asking for clarification really helped and they overlooked the >3 year thing.... this forum really helped me


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## MarcellusF (Nov 6, 2015)

Well, justice prevails. Good to hear they were open to amending their decision. Congrats. Celebrate hard!


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## Skybluebrewer (Jan 15, 2016)

Congrats! Glad it worked out.


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## Mish (Jan 13, 2013)

Congrats!! Now you don't have to go through stage 2


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## guscas (Apr 23, 2017)

They were "too busy"?

It is absurd how DIBP play with people's lives and have no commitment to provide accurate assessments.


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## QQMM (Mar 25, 2017)

Congrats ! Anyway , it is corrected eventually . That means something !


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## CollegeGirl (Nov 10, 2012)

I KNEW if what you were telling us was accurate, if you could get them to actually do their jobs and look to see if they made an error, they'd see they had. Congrats!


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## ampk (Sep 21, 2013)

guscas said:


> They were "too busy"?
> 
> It is absurd how DIBP play with people's lives and have no commitment to provide accurate assessments.


The Case Officer is only given a few hours to process the entire application, it is less than 5 hours.

They are not the blame and work hard and yes are very busy.


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## guscas (Apr 23, 2017)

ampk said:


> The Case Officer is only given a few hours to process the entire application, it is less than 5 hours.
> 
> They are not the blame and work hard and yes are very busy.


Having been in the workforce for a while now, I absolutely understand that most of the time the employee is not to blame. But claiming you're too busy while making a poor assessment on something that changes people's lives should at least hurt your guts and make you rethink your job decision.


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## KofteQueen (Mar 31, 2016)

Congratulations! I'm glad that your persistence paid off.


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