# 2nd year WHV: no farmwork necessary?



## ZYNTHERIUS (Dec 15, 2012)

I'm on my first year on my working holiday visa in Australia.
Me and my friends have done some farmwork in Queensland (in the banana industry) and it was complete exploitation of backpackers. Therefore we quit early

Some dodgy farmer lied about the working conditions and we quit early because it was slavery. I have been to the police to report the farmer but they are too lazy to get involved and don't want the situation to change.

There are people working their butt off for $300 per week in the burning sun. It should be illegal

Now I'm in my 9th month here I have a very good job in Melbourne, but I guess I'll have to leave when my first year runs out.

Is there an alternative for me so I can still do my 2nd year and keep doing this job? Somebody told me that in january 2013 there's a law coming up, enabling backpackers to apply for their 2nd year without doing any farmwork.

Is this true?
What options do I have?

Other friends that I have just get their visas signed off by dodgy farmers in exchange for $300. I hope I don't have to go down that road


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## kttykat (Oct 30, 2012)

ZYNTHERIUS said:


> I'm on my first year on my working holiday visa in Australia.
> Me and my friends have done some farmwork in Queensland (in the banana industry) and it was complete exploitation of backpackers. Therefore we quit early
> 
> Some dodgy farmer lied about the working conditions and we quit early because it was slavery. I have been to the police to report the farmer but they are too lazy to get involved and don't want the situation to change.
> ...


I don't know much about WHVs but you do need to do your 3 months of regional work during your first year to be eligible for a second year visa and only work a maximum of 6 months with any one employer. After reading the conditions though it doesn't say you have to do farm work, only that you must work in a regional area. I noticed 2575 as a postcode is on the list, which is a nice area where you could work in any number of jobs if you wanted and is only an hour and a half from Sydney. There would be many places like that where you could find alternatives to farm work that might suit you better.

Kttykat


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## kttykat (Oct 30, 2012)

Proposed Changes To Australian Working Holiday Visa

OK after reading this, I think I was wrong about doing what you want in a regional area. The link outlines some of the proposed changes, it doesn't say it was accepted though. As I said, I don't know much about this visa so perhaps there are others on the forum who know more about it.

Kttykat


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## CMN (Mar 31, 2012)

ZYNTHERIUS said:


> I'm on my first year on my working holiday visa in Australia.
> Me and my friends have done some farmwork in Queensland (in the banana industry) and it was complete exploitation of backpackers. Therefore we quit early
> 
> Some dodgy farmer lied about the working conditions and we quit early because it was slavery. I have been to the police to report the farmer but they are too lazy to get involved and don't want the situation to change.
> ...


If there was a new law it would have been announced in the "What's New for Working Holidays Visa's'

What's New for Working Holiday Visas

You can do farm work but there are other options such as construction and Mining. As long as its in the right postcode.



> *Definition of specified work*
> 
> Specified work is any type of work described in the list below:
> 
> ...


You're other option is 3 months WOOFing which you don't be paid, you might consider it slavery but it can be good fun if you get into the right crowd.

If you go down the paying the dodgy farmer there is a good chance you will be caught, DIAC are all over this these days and they are catching people out more and more. It an easy route to the Detention Centre and deported and banned for 3 years.

If you haven't done your 88 days I suppose au revoir!!


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## ZYNTHERIUS (Dec 15, 2012)

CMN said:


> If you haven't done your 88 days I suppose au revoir!!


After 3 weeks of being exploited with that farmwork, and being robbed for the 3rd time in 8 months of Australia at that point, I was 100% certain that I would never ever apply for a 2nd year in this country. Because from my experience with employment for backpackers, Australians are by far the most egotistical people on this planet. The only reason why I want to extend now is because I have a proper job now that does not target backpackers to exploit them

Don't take offence please. The regular Australians who are not involved with backpackers are very nice people. But anyone who offers backpacker employment in hostels or any type of farmwork employment tries to scam backpackers and bypass your own laws. Paying by the bin which comes down to $5/ hour. Or woofing which is not paying at all.

What Australians are doing with backpackers is completely against the European constitution and I will do my best to sort it all out and let it be heard internationally.

When I say it is slavery, I am doing that because a similar thing happened in my homecountry 60 years ago when foreigners tried coming in.

I reported a dodgy farmer to the police. Because he signed visas off in exchange for money etc. Think the police helped me?

" Sorry sir, but this is a civil matter. We can't help you out"

My best friend is a producer for a Belgian TV station. They're always looking for ideas to make documentaries.
I will make it all heard and I hope it will make a change in the future.


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## someuser (Nov 6, 2012)

ZYNTHERIUS said:


> After 3 weeks of being exploited with that farmwork, and being robbed for the 3rd time in 8 months of Australia at that point, I was 100% certain that I would never ever apply for a 2nd year in this country. Because from my experience with employment for backpackers, Australians are by far the most egotistical people on this planet. The only reason why I want to extend now is because I have a proper job now that does not target backpackers to exploit them
> 
> Don't take offence please. The regular Australians who are not involved with backpackers are very nice people. But anyone who offers backpacker employment in hostels or any type of farmwork employment tries to scam backpackers and bypass your own laws. Paying by the bin which comes down to $5/ hour. Or woofing which is not paying at all.
> 
> ...


Oh for goodness sake, you have 1 or 2 bad experiences and suddenly everyone in Australia is egotistical. As for the EU constitution, you're not in Europe so go home and whine to them.

You want to see slavery? I live in Kenya. If you told someone here you were only receiving $300 a week they would look at you pretty strangely as that is the monthly wage of an accountant with a degree.

The reality is there are good and bad people everywhere. I have an English friend that did his 88 days working on an Oyster Farm in remote South Australia. He loved it and they loved him. It wasn't a lot of money but they provided a place to stay rent free and expenses were few. It is hard work but if you're willing to put in the work you can be rewarded. 2 weeks ago he just got his skilled working visa so he can stay until 2016 and by then will be eligible for citizenship.


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## CMN (Mar 31, 2012)

ZYNTHERIUS said:


> After 3 weeks of being exploited with that farmwork, and being robbed for the 3rd time in 8 months of Australia at that point, I was 100% certain that I would never ever apply for a 2nd year in this country. Because from my experience with employment for backpackers, Australians are by far the most egotistical people on this planet. The only reason why I want to extend now is because I have a proper job now that does not target backpackers to exploit them
> 
> Don't take offence please. The regular Australians who are not involved with backpackers are very nice people. But anyone who offers backpacker employment in hostels or any type of farmwork employment tries to scam backpackers and bypass your own laws. Paying by the bin which comes down to $5/ hour. Or woofing which is not paying at all.


I came to Australia from the UK 7 years ago and there was no 2nd WHV and you could only only work for one employer for a total of 3 months.

You should consider yourself very fortunate that you have the opportunity to get the 2nd WHV at all, there are many young people from the UK & Ireland are now willing to work for nothing just to get the 88 days so they have the chance to get get the 2nd visa and the possibility of working continuously for an employer for 12 months to increase their chance of obtaining sponsorship.

really its now the case that there are so many backpackers escaping the recession in Europe that there is hardly enough work to go around these days, farmers don't need to pay anything as there many willing to work for nothing. Like you say some are willing to pay the farmer to sign off they are that desperate, for some farmers the temptation of an easy $500 is too much.

Travellers lie to get second year visa extension



ZYNTHERIUS said:


> What Australians are doing with backpackers is completely against the European constitution and I will do my best to sort it all out and let it be heard internationally.


I understand you are from Belgium, but you do know that Australia is not in Europe?



ZYNTHERIUS said:


> When I say it is slavery, I am doing that because a similar thing happened in my homecountry 60 years ago when foreigners tried coming in.


I don't think its slavery, I know you are from Belgium so I will try to make this very simple ......the definition of slavery is



> *slav·er·y [sley-vuh-ree, sleyv-ree] *
> 
> _Synonym _
> Slavery, refer to* involuntary* subjection to another or others. Slavery emphasizes the idea of complete ownership and control by a master: to be sold into slavery.


The key word there is *involuntary*, you can voluntary not do the farm work so it not slavery. You have the choice.

You can choose not to do the 88 days specified work but you wont get a 2nd visa.... That is Australia's choice



ZYNTHERIUS said:


> I reported a dodgy farmer to the police. Because he signed visas off in exchange for money etc. Think the police helped me?
> 
> " Sorry sir, but this is a civil matter. We can't help you out"


That's true, the farmer is breaking immigration law of which the Police at this stage has no jurisdiction. It is up to DIAC to bring a legal case to the Office of Public Prosecutions against the dodgy Farmer.

If you wish to complain you might find this link more suitable

https://www.immi.gov.au/contacts/forms/ssl/dob-in/

and use the *Reporting business or organisation* option.



ZYNTHERIUS said:


> My best friend is a producer for a Belgian TV station. They're always looking for ideas to make documentaries.
> I will make it all heard and I hope it will make a change in the future.


Mate already been done.


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## holly (Dec 11, 2011)

Plus the standard wage for most unskilled work in europe is not much more than 5 bucks an hour, and myself and many friends have worked for basically free while backpacking through europe. Sounds like the pot calling the kettle black. 
Sounds like youve done a lot of your farm days anyhow so just finish them off and youll be sweet for the 2nd WHV


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## ZYNTHERIUS (Dec 15, 2012)

someuser said:


> Oh for goodness sake, you have 1 or 2 bad experiences and suddenly everyone in Australia is egotistical. As for the EU constitution, you're not in Europe so go home and whine to them.
> 
> You want to see slavery? I live in Kenya. If you told someone here you were only receiving $300 a week they would look at you pretty strangely as that is the monthly wage of an accountant with a degree.
> 
> The reality is there are good and bad people everywhere. I have an English friend that did his 88 days working on an Oyster Farm in remote South Australia. He loved it and they loved him. It wasn't a lot of money but they provided a place to stay rent free and expenses were few. It is hard work but if you're willing to put in the work you can be rewarded. 2 weeks ago he just got his skilled working visa so he can stay until 2016 and by then will be eligible for citizenship.


I literally said " dont get me wrong " to clarify that not all Australians are xxxxx and still people like to misquote me as if I stated that all of you are the same.
I'm doing a door to door sales job now and I realise that Australians that are not involved with backpackers are genuine people.

The large amount of backpackers asking for work makes exploitation easy indeed. And it's exactly for that reason that your government should regulate it and set very strict rulings for dodgy farmers, instead of letting them get away with criminal activities.

The issue at my farm was not related to money. It was related to horrible hygiene. I was in my 3rd week of employment, attempting to extend my visa. The rent was huge and the rooms were too filthy for basic hygiene. Many of us wanted to leave and the farmer threatened with not signing off our visas and not paying us the last week's wage.

You and I both know that Queensland is full of dodgy farmers. 
It makes sense that your government wants backpackers to do the dirty work for low wages, but there is a very thin line between employment and exploitation. It needs to be stopped and the police needs to cooperate

300 is a lot in Kenya. However a hostel in Kenya costs $1 for a day and here it's $26 so at the end of the day the value is the same

I already knew before I posted this that it would get slaughtered and there were gonna be pissed off Australians all over the place. It doesn't change the essence of the matter


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## someuser (Nov 6, 2012)

ZYNTHERIUS said:


> I literally said " dont get me wrong " to clarify that not all Australians are xxxxx and still people like to misquote me as if I stated that all of you are the same.
> I'm doing a door to door sales job now and I realise that Australians that are not involved with backpackers are genuine people.
> 
> The large amount of backpackers asking for work makes exploitation easy indeed. And it's exactly for that reason that your government should regulate it and set very strict rulings for dodgy farmers, instead of letting them get away with criminal activities.
> ...


Ha ha. More generalisations. Queensland being full of dodgy farmers is just plain untrue. You've come across a few of hundreds of thousands of them. How do you come to your conclusion based on that?

Obviously you don't know a thing about how much a backpackers costs in Kenya either because what you say is just not true at all and the rates here are really not much different to Australia for any accommodation. This is the reason many hotels and hostels have a different rate for Kenyan citizens. The locals have a hard time paying those kinds of rates. Yes you can live cheaply in the area of food and drinks if you are willing (and I would have agreed with you if you made that point) but you went and picked accommodation as something you thought you knew about but you don't.

I personally know many dozens of farmers that are some of the best people I've ever come across.

You on the other hand are offensive and uneducated on the topics you talk about here.


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## ZYNTHERIUS (Dec 15, 2012)

> Ha ha. More generalisations. Queensland being full of dodgy farmers is just plain untrue. You've come across a few of hundreds of thousands of them. How do you come to your conclusion based on that?


Because in Cairns it is full of hostels connecting you to farmers and I have heard similar stories from backpackers in my hostels.
The common trend for farmers is to charge $200 per week for accomodation and pay out $350 per week to backpackers ( the magical "we pay by the bin" - rule ) so they make enough to survive and all the rest goes to the farmer

Want the name and address? I got plenty of those

I don't care if 250 Australians like your comment because you all deny the simple truth. I can prove it

My farmer charged me $200 for a room full of bugs and when we told him that we would proceed working but with a different location to sleep, he threatened with not signing off our visas. 
An other girl broke her legg and he signed off her visa in exchange for 4 weeks of rent.

An other girl got very sunburnt and it was so bad she couldn't proceed for a few days. The farmer threatened to fire her instead of letting her heal

I pity all you guys for denying that there is a problem.

If you deny that all of the above is the truth, and you find all this okay, you clearly have issues and there is no point in talking to any of you guys.

I am done with this thread and I am done with Australia

Merry Christmas

/thread


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## someuser (Nov 6, 2012)

ZYNTHERIUS said:


> Because in Cairns it is full of hostels connecting you to farmers and I have heard similar stories from backpackers in my hostels.
> The common trend for farmers is to charge $200 per week for accomodation and pay out $350 per week to backpackers ( the magical "we pay by the bin" - rule ) so they make enough to survive and all the rest goes to the farmer
> 
> Want the name and address? I got plenty of those
> ...


Thank god for that!


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## sasasou (Jul 21, 2012)

Even though Zintherius wording may be a bit rough, I actually have to agree with him.
I did my Working Holiday Visa in Australia, and spend more money chasing jobs all around the place than actually earning any money.

Two of the Farming Hostels/Working Hostels I have been to, have been in a terrible condition. I felt terrible living there and it was expensive. I worked once in a shed, the payment was an hourly rate, so this was okay. The second time I picked tomatoes, and it was basically a rip off. I spent more money on accomodation and food than I got paid. The only thing compared to zyntherius that did not happen to me, was that I have been threatened by anybody. I just left and that was okay.

I definitely would not recommend the "pay per bin" thing to anybody, whereas packing, which is usually paid by hour, is quite alright. I also would not want to do another Working Holiday. Rather 6 weeks of pure holiday, but definitely no fruit picking.

In the end I ended up in a small tourist town at the Queensland Coast, where I found a pretty well paid wait staff job.

I think there is really no point of sugar coating about Australia. I assume, that especially in the regional areas, there are many black sheeps to be found, and probably especially in the farming industry. It is like no where else in the world, with the exception, that sun shines brighter and more often.

Just my two cents....


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## sylviav (Mar 28, 2014)

ZYNTHERIUS said:


> After 3 weeks of being exploited with that farmwork, and being robbed for the 3rd time in 8 months of Australia at that point, I was 100% certain that I would never ever apply for a 2nd year in this country. Because from my experience with employment for backpackers, Australians are by far the most egotistical people on this planet. The only reason why I want to extend now is because I have a proper job now that does not target backpackers to exploit them
> 
> Don't take offence please. The regular Australians who are not involved with backpackers are very nice people. But anyone who offers backpacker employment in hostels or any type of farmwork employment tries to scam backpackers and bypass your own laws. Paying by the bin which comes down to $5/ hour. Or woofing which is not paying at all.
> 
> ...


Hi there,
My name is Sylvia and I'm a journalist based in Australia. I'm working on a story about this and would love to speak with you about your experiences. Please call or text me if you are available: +61451990206


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## LouElla (Mar 31, 2014)

I really just want to defend Australians here, I came for my working holiday and unfortunately missed out on my three months work (in Queensland) as where I was supposed to be going was victim of severe flooding (and if you had witnessed the way people came together in the crisis egotistical is not a word I would use at all!!). 

Like ANYWHERE in the world you will have people who will exploit people for cheap labour because they need the work for whatever reason. I think it's very unfair to tar all farmers because of one bad experience, or say anyone involved with backpackers are not genuine people. 

I have NEVER had a problem with anyone in Australia, both on my last visit and this visit. 

Sure you get the odd grumpy get annoyed with all the foreign tourists, but I think I would when someone comes waltzing up to me expecting to be treated better than everyone else just because their a backpacker. I worked in tourism back in the UK and you get people who are grateful to be there and others who think you should be grateful they are there! 

It's a privilege to be able to leave your country and visit another, not everyone can and some who can have worked damn hard to be able to do it. It's an even BIGGER privilege to be able to work in the country your visiting to help fund your visit.


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